2009 Sport Compact Points Series at SCMP

[BlackMagic]

I have been asked to put together a proposal for a Sport Compact bracket for the 2009 season. I have listed below the basic ideas I currently have and would like some feedback. Please be constructive with your comments and stay on topic (off topic posts will be deleted). I will be presenting this information tomorrow at the Spokane Pro-Gas meeting.


2009 Sport Compact Point Series:

-Bracket race using .500 sportsman tree, 1320 ft

-Money payout class run with the regular drag racing program

-Events will be held once per month during the season

-Eliminations will be run in a single elimination bracket format (16 vs 1; 15 vs 2; etc.)

-Point will be determined by final finish position and qualifying position

-mid-season and final events will be double points

-Season points champion will receive payout and trophy

-ET cutoff will be 13.00 and faster

-Quick 16 field

-4 cyl and 6 cyl cars only

-No electronics (delay boxes, etc not allowed)

-Safety equipment dependent on ET and MPH and will be determined by final sanctioning body.

[Gsolo]

Maybe I'm asking a dumb question, what is meant by "Quick 16 Field"?

And would Sport Compact be defined by engine size, car size ? Although I suppose we don't have a lot of 13.00 or faster small motored cars, a good handful but not a lot.

*cough* and what about V8 sport compacts? :D

Just questions...I love the idea of more organized events/classes at the track.

oh, i guess one last minute thought...is this something they're looking at being a part of "street racing" night or actually having it part of a bracket racing day with just multiple classes? My thought, if its once a month then having it say before/during/after "street racing" would probably have big turnout.

[VWLover]

I would say you have pretty much covered all the bases in the outline you came up with. Of course with the exception of small details that won't come up till later. You know the BS LOL Great job man!

[sr240]

sounds good to me.. sud be 13.49 and faster tho.. cuz i dont thing we have 16 cars that will run 13.00 or faster lol

[BlackMagic]

sounds good to me.. sud be 13.49 and faster tho.. cuz i dont thing we have 16 cars that will run 13.00 or faster lol

I think youll be surprised about the number of cars at 13.00 and faster. In fact, I think by mid-season the quick 16 field will cut off at 12.50. And if there isnt a full 16 field it just means less people you have to beat to get in the money.

Maybe I'm asking a dumb question, what is meant by "Quick 16 Field"?

And would Sport Compact be defined by engine size, car size ? Although I suppose we don't have a lot of 13.00 or faster small motored cars, a good handful but not a lot.

*cough* and what about V8 sport compacts?

Just questions...I love the idea of more organized events/classes at the track.

oh, i guess one last minute thought...is this something they're looking at being a part of "street racing" night or actually having it part of a bracket racing day with just multiple classes? My thought, if its once a month then having it say before/during/after "street racing" would probably have big turnout.

A "quick 16" field refers to the quickest 16 cars for that bracket. Those who want to compete would have to qualify to run the eliminations.

The definition of a sport compact is a detail that needs to be worked out, but as a general rule we would probably use those chassis designated by NHRA to be acceptable in the sport compact events.

There are no sport compact V8's...only midsize and bigger :)

Lastly, this points series is not, and will not (as long as I have a say) be associated with the street racing events. The purpose of this class is to give the dedicated sport compact racers an opportunity at a real event with payouts and points.

[97GSX]

I think you have covered all areas. Nice work Reid.

[a1320honda]

YEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ive been waiting for an organized spo-com bracket point series to come around. I was thinking about running in Seattle cause they have a setup to run the sport compacts in an organized class every other week for points.

And im gonna second the statement that by mid season, theirs gonna be a good 16.....maybe 32 car field that would be involved in chasing points. I can think of 10 or so right now that are gonna run 12.50 or faster. if i can be of assistance, let me know....im down to get a "Quick 16" class goin, but it would almost be cooler if it was a heads up class on a pro .500 tree. It will help everyone step up their game...so to speak. I know it will never happen, but it would be badass!

[BlackMagic]

A heads up class could be an option, but as with any heads up racing...he who spends the most money wins (most of the time) and that is really not what we are trying to do here.

[a1320honda]

A heads up class could be an option, but as with any heads up racing...he who spends the most money wins (most of the time) and that is really not what we are trying to do here.


Oh i know, it would just be nice to see any heads up racing at our track i guess, but a spo-com heads up class would be sweet. I know there are several guys that should run single digits next year....cough Reid, cough Josh, cough Travis.

Are we talking about a strickly 4-6 cylinder class, or will it be a street legal class? And is it gonna be discriminated by power adders, N/A...ect.? I know these are alot of questions that will prolly be answered before next year, just seein what the thoughts are.

[black69camaro]

hey just a suggestion, I was thinking about bringing it up later, but if you want to do heads up, you can run an index. Like its heads up but have 10.50 or 11.50 and so on breakout. You can change that breakout time to what ever the class wants. Some people will have to detune, others will, like you say "step it up" Maybe we can to this for both domestic and import? just a suggestion

[a1320honda]

hey just a suggestion, I was thinking about bringing it up later, but if you want to do heads up, you can run an index. Like its heads up but have 10.50 or 11.50 and so on breakout. You can change that breakout time to what ever the class wants. Some people will have to detune, others will, like you say "step it up" Maybe we can to this for both domestic and import? just a suggestion

it would prolly work for the domestics since there a wide range of times bein run, but we wouldnt have the car count to fill, lets say an 11.50 index. But i think some sort of heads up would be nice to watch next year.

[sr240]

i think that this is a great idea.. i just dont want the muscle car guys to be assholes to us import guys like they usually are.. we are all here to race..

[a1320honda]

i just dont want the muscle car guys to be assholes to us import guys like they usually are

This is never gonna stop.

[rrussell]

I have been asked to put together a proposal for a Sport Compact bracket for the 2009 season. I have listed below the basic ideas I currently have and would like some feedback. Please be constructive with your comments and stay on topic (off topic posts will be deleted). I will be presenting this information tomorrow at the Spokane Pro-Gas meeting.


2009 Sport Compact Point Series:

-Bracket race using .500 sportsman tree, 1320 ft

-Money payout class run with the regular drag racing program

-Events will be held once per month during the season

-Eliminations will be run in a single elimination bracket format (16 vs 1; 15 vs 2; etc.)

-Point will be determined by final finish position and qualifying position

-mid-season and final events will be double points

-Season points champion will receive payout and trophy

-ET cutoff will be 13.00 and faster

-Quick 16 field

-4 cyl and 6 cyl cars only

-No electronics (delay boxes, etc not allowed)

-Safety equipment dependent on ET and MPH and will be determined by final sanctioning body.

"-Eliminations will be run in a single elimination bracket format (16 vs 1; 15 vs 2; etc.)"

So will this mean that the fastest qualifier and the slowest qualifier will pair off in the first round based on ET and mph from the days event dial in?

If so will you also receive extra points for being the fastest of the event?

This is cool because it will make everyone lean on their cars a little harder.;)

[x NOODLES x]

There are no sport compact V8's...only midsize and bigger :)



Isn't the M3 a "sport compact"?

[sr240]

yes it is..

[black69camaro]

hey now, i wasnt bashing on the import guys, I definetly respect what you guys (and girls) can do. I was just suggesting index racing with specific beakouts I dont care what the times are

[a1320honda]

hey now, i wasnt bashing on the import guys, I definetly respect what you guys (and girls) can do. I was just suggesting index racing with specific beakouts I dont care what the times are


I dont think anyone was specificly talking about you....its just when we (import guys) go to the track, all the muscle car guys treat us like dirt.

[BlackMagic]

"-Eliminations will be run in a single elimination bracket format (16 vs 1; 15 vs 2; etc.)"

So will this mean that the fastest qualifier and the slowest qualifier will pair off in the first round based on ET and mph from the days event dial in?

If so will you also receive extra points for being the fastest of the event?

This is cool because it will make everyone lean on their cars a little harder.;)

Yes, just like you would see in a basketball bracket.

Also, yes, the top qualifier (possibly top 3) at the event would receive extra "bonus" points.

[BlackMagic]

hey just a suggestion, I was thinking about bringing it up later, but if you want to do heads up, you can run an index. Like its heads up but have 10.50 or 11.50 and so on breakout. You can change that breakout time to what ever the class wants. Some people will have to detune, others will, like you say "step it up" Maybe we can to this for both domestic and import? just a suggestion

Index classes would be a hard sell. The sport compact field is kind of all over the place...there are several in the 12's, some in the 11's and a few will be a little faster :).

[BlackMagic]

Isn't the M3 a "sport compact"?

Most of the M3 family has either an I4 or I6 engine...

[BlackMagic]

What if we had the ability to run a bracket race with no breakout? Im not sure if it would work, but basically the winner would be the person who ran closest to the dial in +or-.

Let me know what you guys think

[gregc]

What if we had the ability to run a bracket race with no breakout? Im not sure if it would work, but basically the winner would be the person who ran closest to the dial in +or-.

Let me know what you guys think


How would reaction time come into play then? What about who takes the stripe? I've been sitting here trying to figure if/how that would work and I don't think it could. Unless you did it like an NHRA Comp class and used records and indexes. Which makes it all too complex IMO.

[BlackMagic]

How would reaction time come into play then? What about who takes the stripe? I've been sitting here trying to figure if/how that would work and I don't think it could. Unless you did it like an NHRA Comp class and used records and indexes. Which makes it all too complex IMO.

I just had this conversation with Russ.
Im not sure how reaction time would come into play...I was hoping one of you smart guys could figure it out lol.

Anyway, ill move forward with a standard bracket setup w/ breakouts.

[black69camaro]

sounds like a good plan, keeping it simple while this track is starting out is probably a good plan

[AWD_Launch]

I just had this conversation with Russ.
Im not sure how reaction time would come into play...I was hoping one of you smart guys could figure it out lol.

Anyway, ill move forward with a standard bracket setup w/ breakouts.

Easy you set it up where the time adds R/T plus the time off your dial in together and the person with the lowest total wins, break out or not. The person with printing the times might have to figure it out though because I don't think the timing system has that feature (I could be wrong though)

[AWD_Launch]

I know there are several guys that should run single digits next year... cough Travis.



I wish, thats way too fast for me, I had fun running mid 10's and that was plenty for me (1st gear is insane and gone in under 1.8 seconds). I'd rather make tons of slower runs than hit 1-2 fast runs and break stuff. Its a DSM after all, I want to make it a season and spend less than a grand on stuff that break just having fun. I might even detune it a bit so it runs 11.50's all day long so I don't have to cage it or let off after 3/4 of the track.


Back on topic, Reid this is a great idea and I think it would be a great hit. Maybe not 32 cars but 16 shouldn't be too hard to get.

[BlackMagic]

Thanks for the comments guys. I have finished my proposal and I will hopefully be able to sell it to the higher ups.

[x NOODLES x]

Most of the M3 family has either an I4 or I6 engine...

Is or is not the M3 a sport compact???

lol. sorry I'm just bein' an ass.

But in truth the new V8 M3 SHOULD be allowed.

[sr240]

a m3 is a sport compact.....

[x NOODLES x]

lol. I know.

I'm just screwin around.

[BlackMagic]

The M3 is not a compact. It is a midsize, however, the older M3 fits in with both the engine displacement and engine configuration restrictions as set so it will be allowed.

The new M3 is a 4.0L V8 and will not be allowed to run in the sport compact class (if one should develop the way I presented).

Anyway, the proposal has been submitted. Now we wait.

The jackers can now take this thread wherever they want.

[x NOODLES x]

See then I learned something new.

The 4/6 2door m3's are sport compacts and the new v8 is a midsize.

Doesn't make any sense to me, but if that's what it is, that's what it is.

[Gsolo]

See then I learned something new.

The 4/6 2door m3's are sport compacts and the new v8 is a midsize.

Doesn't make any sense to me, but if that's what it is, that's what it is.

Any M3 with a factory V8 is a little bigger than a "Sport Compact".

By that rule though, Supras aren't sport compact either then.

[sr240]

the rules dont cut out a supra.. it says 6cyl cars can race.. i think the cut off is going to be 3.5 liter..

[BlackMagic]

Below if the text of the finished proposal. It has been submitted to Jay Livingston and now we just need to wait and see what he thinks. I think this proposal covers the basic nature of what a sport compact series should be. If follows very closely to the old NHRA Sport Compact quick 16 with the exception of the ET and displacement cutoffs. Anyway, Ill keep everyone updated on anything new.

Purpose

The proposed SCMP Sport Compact Points Series is intended to give the more serious sport compact drag racers a chance to compete against similar vehicles and accrue points and payouts throughout the drag racing season. The series will be limited by ET and field size to maintain the intended design.

Class Organization and Structure

The basic structure is a modified ET bracket class with money payouts and points awarded which parallel the system currently in place within the NHRA Drag Racing organization.

• The field will be limited to the fastest 16 sport compact vehicles as determined during the qualifying rounds.
• ET will be limited to 12.99 seconds and faster. If less than 16 cars qualify a modified ladder will be used according to the car count.
• Eliminations will be handicap start based on dial-in time determined during qualifying.
• Single eliminations, cars eliminated can move into regular bracket program
• Utilize a 0.500 sportsman tree and a race distance of 1320 ft.
• Class limited to 4 and 6 cylinder cars with a max displacement of 3.5L
• Events will be held once per month during the regular racing season
• Events will be held during the normal drag racing program (not street racing)
• No electronics. Delay devices, throttle stops, air shifters, and transbrakes are prohibited.

Points and Payouts

Points will be awarded based on qualifying position and final position in accordance with current NHRA point standards.

• Cash payouts to winner and runner-up at each event. Monies for payouts will be generated from sponsor dollars and/or part of entry fees.
• Mid-season and final Sport Compact Series events will be double points.
• Season points champion and runner-up will receive trophy and cash payout (or equivalent) at the conclusion of the racing season.

Safety and Other

Safety equipment required dependent on ET and MPH and will be determined by the final sanctioning body.

Responsibility for tracking season point totals will be the responsibility of the Sport Compact Series director

[Gsolo]

the rules dont cut out a supra.. it says 6cyl cars can race.. i think the cut off is going to be 3.5 liter..

I meant if someone is referring to "midsize" car then a Supra falls in the category...cause they aren't small cars. Either way, I like what has been proposed.

I'm sure later future once everything has panned out and more racers, other niches of classes will work in so most will get some sort of bracket outlet, at least more to what NHRA kinda offers or at least use to.


Just ranting now, I think a 4cylinder only class would be unique albeit Hondas and handful of DSMs. FWD class as well...and possibly different brackets of the class. I guess theres a bunch of ways to look at it...Reids proposal I think at least is a good blanket cover, and as been stated really not many cars coming out of the wood work as of yet.

[sr240]

i was thinking about it and there sudnt be a cut off.. since there are going to be quite abit of cars in it you have 2 qualifying passes and you take the top 16 cars.. no need for a cut off right??

[BlackMagic]

Still need a cut-off. If there is a day we dont have a full 16 car field...do you want to lose in the money round to a 17 sec automatic?

The bracket will be based off the number of cars...if there are only 14 we run a 14 car bracket.

[Bad Bug Two]

•Class limited to 4 and 6 cylinder cars with a max displacement of 3.5L

Dang, I guess I won't order this engine yet then....

http://www.cal-look.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=16637.0;attach=219 29;image

It's a prototype of a new horizontally apposed 4-cylinder that will have a maximum bore of 5" and a maximum stroke of 4.7"! For those that don't want to do the math, that's just over 6 liters!

If I win the lottery, that engine should help me to win a Darwin's award!

:)

[sr240]

ya but by the looks of things, we are gonna have big turn outs..

[Racemyjetta85]

• No electronics. Delay devices, throttle stops, air shifters, and transbrakes are prohibited.


does this "electronics" include my engine management? or just the mentioned electronics?

[Gsolo]

Still need a cut-off. If there is a day we dont have a full 16 car field...do you want to lose in the money round to a 17 sec automatic?

The bracket will be based off the number of cars...if there are only 14 we run a 14 car bracket.

Not to mention how many slow cars would show up trying to qualify just wasting time.