If it was YOU...

[BlackMagic]

I have heard enough people bitching about the Friday Night staging procedures to peak my interest. As most of you know, I have run the staging lanes for Friday night events since 2002 (with the exception of 2 years when I was in college). I ran the events during the progas sponsored races of 2008 when we had nearly 300 cars (we averaged around 120 this year). I have never changed the way I run staging and, until this year, never heard this many complaints about the procedure.

I understand that there were some frustrating situations on Friday nights; many of which were out of my control. I have had enough people point out the problem, but as always...very few willing to point out a solution.

So, the question is this. IF IT WAS YOU; HOW WOULD STAGING BE RUN (smooth as silk as Scooter would say)?

[BlackMagic]

Also, lets try to keep this constructive.

Thx

[x NOODLES x]

Why not like saturdays? (Ihavent been to a sat. in awhile so it may have changed.)

Assign lanes at the gate, even number of cars/bikes in each lane, have the announcer call what lane is up next.

Seems SUPER simple to me, I've always wondered why it was this 'floating' number from each lane that gets to go.

[Gsolo]

To me it just seemed with the more cars participating the more confusing it seemed. I haven't ran since I think the Progas year...so take what I say lightly. But I can see how hard it can be to try to evenly run through that many cars. I think we've discussed this before, and I remember we all agreed that no matter how its ran someone is going to bitch and complain. The only major complaint I ever had was with the bikes, and I dont think thats been a problem in a long time now.

I kind of like the assigned lane idea, but could drivers still line up against who they want to?

And this may not be a problem any more...but once you pull into the staging lanes you should be locked in to the lane and can't leave your car....THAT always pissed me off. Not under your control but did cause problems once in awhile.

[talntid]

Reid,

Last Friday, I was just watching, not racing. I witnessed the same cars getting multiple runs, and people like Kevin Anders with the Viper, get 2 runs, even when after he ran, he lined back up for another pass, and sat in staging for a very long time.

I think, that the best way to do it, would be to simply add to what you are doing, a simple thing:

As you roll the cars out, make a mark on the windshield with the same kind of pen that the numbers are written with. Just make a dot every pass. This way, at a glance, everyone can know how many passes the cars have had, and you can judge what cars to take based on the lower number of dots.

[scooter]

5-6 pairs from each lane go through all the lanes in order, and then start over, run the hot loop every other cycle through the lanes. same with bikes every other time. those guys will get up to 6-7 runs a night while a few friends of mine were out there on friday sat in line for 3 hours and got one run.

just run it like we did back in 01-05

[silver_echo]

Reid,

Last Friday, I was just watching, not racing. I witnessed the same cars getting multiple runs, and people like Kevin Anders with the Viper, get 2 runs, even when after he ran, he lined back up for another pass, and sat in staging for a very long time.

I think, that the best way to do it, would be to simply add to what you are doing, a simple thing:

As you roll the cars out, make a mark on the windshield with the same kind of pen that the numbers are written with. Just make a dot every pass. This way, at a glance, everyone can know how many passes the cars have had, and you can judge what cars to take based on the lower number of dots.

that is an interesting idea there... has some potential... however, not trying to poke holes, but what about if people catch on, and start wiping off? i cannot speak to how staging is working, as i have not been out this year... still getting my stuff taken care of with the wrx... should be ready for the first day next year...

[x NOODLES x]

Reid,

Last Friday, I was just watching, not racing. I witnessed the same cars getting multiple runs, and people like Kevin Anders with the Viper, get 2 runs, even when after he ran, he lined back up for another pass, and sat in staging for a very long time.



I was the 8th car to go. And that was my only run of the night. And I left at 1030.

[trbo355]

I think one problem i see is instead of running maybe 6 cars from each lane before moving on, id run the whole lane. If a guy has to put on his helmet and safety harness crap only to take it all back off, it can be frustrating.

The other good reason for running the whole lane starting from the left and working to the right is you KNOW exactly how long you have till you run again. You can use the bathroom or walk around and enjoy yourself a bit. Plus you dont have to move your car forward a little bit at a time and baby sit the car as much.

If you know the car will be stationary for a while, it takes a lot of the babysitting stress out of the equation. I suppose the right lanes could be designated for people that dont care who they run against and the other lanes could be for grudge racing.

If a person doesnt have a race lined up yet, DONT PULL FORWARD till you do and then line up front to back so you only have to pull one lane to get the job done. I say once a lane is moving, keep it moving.

Of course you have to try and figure when to stop the lane so guys dont get a back to back hit but if a big chunk of the lane moved at once, nobody should have a problem if they get cutoff considering they were 10 miles back in the lane to start with correct?

Your job is a pain in the ass Reid and i think your doing a good job at it and posts like this are a good thing to speed up efficiency!

[BlackMagic]

Thanks to everyone for the suggestions. Hopefully,this dialog can continue to be productive and we can make adjustments to make things better in the future.

Periodically, I will respond to a few ideas as I have done below. Everyone's input is valuable and necessary, so I take all of this and consider how it would work in the field, so to speak.

I have posed some questions/comments to each of the ideas listed below. These questions are not intended to "challenge" anyone's ideas; please do not take it that way. These questions are asked to create awareness of how a given solution might affect other aspects of the event.

Thank you.

Why not like saturdays? (Ihavent been to a sat. in awhile so it may have changed.)

Assign lanes at the gate, even number of cars/bikes in each lane, have the announcer call what lane is up next.

Seems SUPER simple to me, I've always wondered why it was this 'floating' number from each lane that gets to go.

Structure is the enemy of Friday nights. The whole purpose of this was for people to come out, line up with someone, and race. Assigning lanes at the gate would eliminate the opportunity for people to grudge race as everyone has a set lane to race from. Also, people dont all show up at 7:00 to race. It is a constant influx of cars and those might get assigned a lane that just ran and so they have to wait, while their buddy who arrived 10 minutes later gets to run immediately.

We then end up with the same dilemma that we have now. If structured, class style racing is what you are looking for then you need to be racing on Saturday. That is why it costs more to race on Saturday.

To me it just seemed with the more cars participating the more confusing it seemed. I haven't ran since I think the Progas year...so take what I say lightly. But I can see how hard it can be to try to evenly run through that many cars. I think we've discussed this before, and I remember we all agreed that no matter how its ran someone is going to bitch and complain. The only major complaint I ever had was with the bikes, and I dont think thats been a problem in a long time now.

I kind of like the assigned lane idea, but could drivers still line up against who they want to?

And this may not be a problem any more...but once you pull into the staging lanes you should be locked in to the lane and can't leave your car....THAT always pissed me off. Not under your control but did cause problems once in awhile.

See above with respect to lane assignments.

Reid,

Last Friday, I was just watching, not racing. I witnessed the same cars getting multiple runs, and people like Kevin Anders with the Viper, get 2 runs, even when after he ran, he lined back up for another pass, and sat in staging for a very long time.

I think, that the best way to do it, would be to simply add to what you are doing, a simple thing:

As you roll the cars out, make a mark on the windshield with the same kind of pen that the numbers are written with. Just make a dot every pass. This way, at a glance, everyone can know how many passes the cars have had, and you can judge what cars to take based on the lower number of dots.

I could work with this idea, but we may need to refine. As stated what is to stop people from wiping off the dot. Also, how would we pull a car that is in a center lane 6 cars back when all other cars around have 3 dots on their window? How would we control the people who show up at 10:00pm instead of 7:00? Would they get to make 3 quick passes to catch up to the others who have waited patiently all night to make their 3 passes?

5-6 pairs from each lane go through all the lanes in order, and then start over, run the hot loop every other cycle through the lanes. same with bikes every other time. those guys will get up to 6-7 runs a night while a few friends of mine were out there on friday sat in line for 3 hours and got one run.

just run it like we did back in 01-05

This is exactly how it was done (3-4 pairs of cars from each lane). I even discuss this during the drivers meeting...we start at lane 1 and move to the left pulling the SAME number of cars from each, then we go back to lane 1 and start over. Since 2002, I have never changed my method of staging cars.

Bikes are skipped and only run every 2 rounds if I run the whole lane. When I have enough bikes in the lane I split the group. I am sure most of you dont pay attention to WHICH bikes are running every pass...you just see bikes run and assume they are all getting to run every pass. I assure you, that is not the case.

I was the 8th car to go. And that was my only run of the night. And I left at 1030.

I posed a question to someone on Friday who complained about waiting in line and I will pose the same to you.

We run lanes 4-10 each and every Friday night with bikes in lane 4 and cars in the 5-10. Yet, 90% of the people lane up in lanes 5-8 on every single pass. Why would you choose the lane with 15 cars when the lane just to your right only has 2?

[Ryfly05]

Personally I think the problem isnt with how the lanes are run, I think its how the track is run. Seems like we can never run more than 3-4 sets of cars before either someones POS blows up, or they have to check the track for some other reason for a half hour. Im all about safety and having a good surface to race on, but why in gods name does it take them soooo long to get it done?? Every 15-20 mins they take a half hour break to walk the track. It was never like this a few years ago even when we had just as many if not much more cars out there.

I like martys idea of running more cars from the same lane. Another thing I would do is not run the "hot loop" cars so much. It seems like not more than 2 or 3 of those cars can go through without blowing up and/or something happening where the crew has to check the track for 20 mins. Very frustrating.

Saturday bracket racing is where its at imo. Sooo much smoother operations, better track prep, much more organized, everything moves along like it should even if a car does break. Fridays were a joke this year to be honest.

[x NOODLES x]

This is exactly how it was done (3-4 pairs of cars from each lane). I even discuss this during the drivers meeting...we start at lane 1 and move to the left pulling the SAME number of cars from each, then we go back to lane 1 and start over. Since 2002, I have never changed my method of staging cars.

Bikes are skipped and only run every 2 rounds if I run the whole lane. When I have enough bikes in the lane I split the group. I am sure most of you dont pay attention to WHICH bikes are running every pass...you just see bikes run and assume they are all getting to run every pass. I assure you, that is not the case.


I WAS watching you stage, and trust me, u didnt pull 3/4 pairs out of each lane, each time. Granted it can be hard to keep track, and some mistakes are gonna happen. But it was a little more than, 'some'.

I personally saw sometimes 12 cars coming from a lane, and the lanes with the drag cars ALWAYS got almost, if not the whole lane to run.

[x NOODLES x]

I posed a question to someone on Friday who complained about waiting in line and I will pose the same to you.

We run lanes 4-10 each and every Friday night with bikes in lane 4 and cars in the 5-10. Yet, 90% of the people lane up in lanes 5-8 on every single pass. Why would you choose the lane with 15 cars when the lane just to your right only has 2?

lol. U must assume your talking to an idiot. I lined up in a lane with 5 cars at the time. And I waited over 2 1/2 hours. Granted there was some carnage on the track, but ti was still excessive.

And yes Saturday is more suited for me, I like structure. But I dont like burning 5 hours on friday night, getting 1 run.

I couldn't even go watch the cars because at any moment 10 could have been taken from my lane, and I would have screwed somebody behind me cause I wasnt at my car.

[x NOODLES x]

Structure is the enemy of Friday nights. The whole purpose of this was for people to come out, line up with someone, and race. Assigning lanes at the gate would eliminate the opportunity for people to grudge race as everyone has a set lane to race from. Also, people dont all show up at 7:00 to race. It is a constant influx of cars and those might get assigned a lane that just ran and so they have to wait, while their buddy who arrived 10 minutes later gets to run immediately.






Structure being the enemy will never make money.


Now about the lane assigments.......

Have lane assignments given at tech then. If your buddy is coming, wait for him, go tech together and work out an arrangement to get in the same lane, its not that hard.

And for solos, assign 2 per lane at tech. Its real simple..... 1,1 2,2 3,3 4,4 5,5.

And if we have an odd number, well then step aside until another odd comes through. There are plenty of them. Or simply keep track of which lane had the last single, then add the next one to it......

I appreciate the volunteer work going on, and I dont know if some, or anyone gets paid on friday night, but you should, it is a job.

But it certainly isnt rocket science, its BASIC organization. Which there seems to be little of.

[trbo355]

Personally I think the problem isnt with how the lanes are run, I think its how the track is run. Seems like we can never run more than 3-4 sets of cars before either someones POS blows up, or they have to check the track for some other reason for a half hour. Im all about safety and having a good surface to race on, but why in gods name does it take them soooo long to get it done?? Every 15-20 mins they take a half hour break to walk the track. It was never like this a few years ago even when we had just as many if not much more cars out there.

I like martys idea of running more cars from the same lane. Another thing I would do is not run the "hot loop" cars so much. It seems like not more than 2 or 3 of those cars can go through without blowing up and/or something happening where the crew has to check the track for 20 mins. Very frustrating.

Saturday bracket racing is where its at imo. Sooo much smoother operations, better track prep, much more organized, everything moves along like it should even if a car does break. Fridays were a joke this year to be honest.
Yeah, that would be me and my buddies junky stuff that blows up and shuts down the track. LOL. Kind of like Marshalls locked rearend gears and the rollback that ate up 1/2 hr. Oops! Didnt plan on that.
There are much less hot loop guys so i can see how we all get to go at once (and get more runs) compared to the regular lanes. You guys gotta remember its a lot more pain in the ass for us to get belted in, keep the bottle heater up to temp, put on the helmet, blah blah blah. So if ANY of the hot loop gets pulled, they all should go. Especially since they usually drag the track before the hot loop runs so we can stick. I apologize for having any advantage running out of the hot loop in the amount of runs we get but i guess thats how it goes eh?

Another thing ebout the hot loop is drawing in more spectators. Fast stupid cars are more fun to watch and draw more people to the track to watch them. More spectators= more profit. You run em more and the excitement factor goes up for everyone.

[silver_echo]

Structure being the enemy will never make money.


Now about the lane assigments.......

Have lane assignments given at tech then. If your buddy is coming, wait for him, go tech together and work out an arrangement to get in the same lane, its not that hard.

And for solos, assign 2 per lane at tech. Its real simple..... 1,1 2,2 3,3 4,4 5,5.

And if we have an odd number, well then step aside until another odd comes through. There are plenty of them. Or simply keep track of which lane had the last single, then add the next one to it......

I appreciate the volunteer work going on, and I dont know if some, or anyone gets paid on friday night, but you should, it is a job.

But it certainly isnt rocket science, its BASIC organization. Which there seems to be little of.

but occasionally while we are out there, we see someone that we want to race, last minute... like say i get out there, run into jetblack, and want to race him, but we teched separately and have different numbers...

now my curiosity question would be to see what kind of cross-section of cars we have out there... i.e. bikes vs. slicks vs. street tires...

if for example, we have 12 bikes, 16 slicks and 52 streets, then my thought would be run 6 bikes, 8 slicks, and 26 streets/ cycle...

now i know that the numbers will NEVER be that easy, but this is my suggestion...

[x NOODLES x]

Yeah, that would be me and my buddies junky stuff that blows up and shuts down the track. LOL. Kind of like Marshalls locked rearend gears and the rollback that ate up 1/2 hr. Oops! Didnt plan on that.
There are much less hot loop guys so i can see how we all get to go at once (and get more runs) compared to the regular lanes. You guys gotta remember its a lot more pain in the ass for us to get belted in, keep the bottle heater up to temp, put on the helmet, blah blah blah. So if ANY of the hot loop gets pulled, they all should go. Especially since they usually drag the track before the hot loop runs so we can stick. I apologize for having any advantage running out of the hot loop in the amount of runs we get but i guess thats how it goes eh?

Another thing ebout the hot loop is drawing in more spectators. Fast stupid cars are more fun to watch and draw more people to the track to watch them. More spectators= more profit. You run em more and the excitement factor goes up for everyone.

Breakage happens, and is to be expected, delays for such are just a part of racing.

And drawing fans IS the ultimate goal. which is why it should be more organized like saturday, so Joe Blow crusin the lanes checkin cars out can get back to his seat when he hears the crazy fast cars are running.

But there are only a few in that lane on Fridays that have the process to go through to get ready like you do with that Mullet machine!! lol. ALOT of those cars were just buckle and helmet, and maybe a bottle heater. Which is the same process some of the 'other lane' guys are going through too. :D

Again, something that could be solved with assigned lanes and a lane order.

[89/00/02TA]

The idea Marty had of starting with the bikes runs them all through, move to lane 2 run that lane all the way through and so on until you reach the end of the hot loop is the best idea. I recall a few times honda buddies of yours getting pulled like steve in his green hatch did last week when he was lined up in lane 5 the fifth car back behind my buddies black camaro and noodles and his friend but yet he pulled around us and made a pass and then we still waited over an hour to make our first pass. The last two fridays I have gone out I have got to the staging lanes at 730 and didnt make one pass until 10-1030 while the bikes and the cars from the hot loop I watched make 2-3 passes. You are very inconsistant with how many cars you pull from a lane one time is 12 and then you move to the next lane and its 4 and then the next lane 6 and back to 12 for the next lane. Each lane should be run through and then move onto the next. When I use to go out there and pay $5-$7 to race I was pretty much guaranteed to get atleast 3 passes but the average was 5-7 now that we pay $15 and there is not nearly as many people there we only get 1-2 something seems wrong there. Also off topic I dont mind paying the $15 but I would bet since the prices have been that high the car and spectator count is almost half of what it use to be. I remember back in the day when all 10 lanes were packed front to back with cars, the stands were full to pretty close to the 1/8th mile with spectators and we still made more passes and it was twice as much fun as it is now. Honestly I have been so frustrated with the way the track as a whole has been ran this year I really have no desire to come out there anymore and I have been a die hard customer of theirs for almost 10 years. I really hope they get their shit together and make it a fun place to be again sometime soon or I think we will lose that track. Hopefully this year was just a test year and everything smoothes out next year.

[bowtiy]

the only issue with running the whole lane through, is the guys who run and then haul ass back to staging to get into the next lane to run, and so on...
friday's are gonna be a mess no matter what... i havent raced a friday since the very first year it started, i've never understood why people will put up with the headache every friday and end up bitching about it instead of just coming out on saturday having a good time, and actually racing for a purpose...

just run 4 lanes out of the hot loop, 2 lanes for people that just want to run, and the other 2 for grudge matches... dont line up till youve got a race, or your runnin the person next to you....

use a couple lanes in staging for the cars that are fast enough to be unsafe to run with cars that have no safety....

[Ryfly05]

My point about the cars breaking was how long it takes the crew to get their shit together and make the track runable again. Hell a lot of the time I go up to the stands and the track is empty and nobody is doing anything. Like Steve said, there used to be just as many if not more cars out there, people would break just as much, and we would still get 4-5 passes a night. Something has changed. I go out there thinking each week will be different than the week before, but it never changes.

[Gsolo]

My point about the cars breaking was how long it takes the crew to get their shit together and make the track runable again. Hell a lot of the time I go up to the stands and the track is empty and nobody is doing anything.

I think part of that is with the concrete surface they're more serious about track prep and maintenance.

I like the 4 lane idea, the two for set up grudge racing and the other two for just run whoever is next to you. Switch off between the two sets and it is what it is. In all honesty thats all the friday night is for. With respect to Marty's input of himself and other fast cars FNSR is what it is and you are going to be there with all kinds of other cars. Trying to segregate "classes" of cars because of convenience for a few just irritates those that the program is more leaning towards. I dunno...it sounds to simple and I think theres other things that complicate it beyond some of our scope.

Although I do agree if you want a structured organized event then go bracket racing on saturday. Nature of the beast FNSR will always have issues somewhere.

[x NOODLES x]

Although I do agree if you want a structured organized event then go bracket racing on saturday. Nature of the beast FNSR will always have issues somewhere.

That sort of thinking is why it will ultimately be short of successful. Or will all out fail.

[trbo355]

Will the hot loop support 4 lanes of cars? Its not a bad idea. It would kind of suck if you were in the back and trying to watch the racing action but it sure would calm down lane confusion.
The only real difference between the old days and now is the partial lane pulls and the meticulous track prep.
The track prep and safety precautions is a good thing since how dangerous was it to run 2 more cars without spotters reporting from the top end of the track that the coast was clear? Somebodys car pukes and they shut off the headlights and its an accident waiting to happen. Or the first timer that turned around on the track because they missed the side exit?

Plus do you wanna go fast or spin all the way down the track? The old track surface was a piece of shit and i dont miss it one bit. How much does the track spend on VHT for an average friday night? That place probably barely breaks even on profit with lights, insurance, paychecks etc. But we get to race for 15 lousy bucks. And people bitch that costs went up.
We all bitch when we have no track. And we bitch when we DO have a track. Im glad the place is open even if it is frustrating at times.

[x NOODLES x]

+1 Marty.

I have insiders in 'office' saying that everyone bitches about helping with the track, the track makes no money, and that Northern Quest is REALLY pushing to buy it..........

Thats why I FORCED myself to go out there friday even though it wasnt really planned. I by no means want to lose the track, and will support the track even if its much more than $15 bucks a night.

[98Z28]

First off, I would not want your job!!! There is no way that the officials can plan for every situation. Even when I run my car I like to watch the faster cars; they are exciting to watch! I like the idea of having one or two lanes for grudge racing. There is still structure for those who don't care who we race and freedom for those who want to pair up. There is no way for everyone to get the exact number of runs every night. As long as the officials are trying to be fair to everyone that's all we can expect. Stick with your system. If you are used to it, it will be easier for you to keep it fair.

Ok, off the soap box now.

[2bad]

The track wasnt purchased as a money making venture though. In the begining the whole reason for the track was to help with keeping kids off the street, but with all of the bs about keeping a schedule without canceling for road racing, and just closing even though the weather is fine, its rediculous.

IMO. Keep it open for fnsr, keep it smooth running, prices down, the weather is fine use what we have instead of trying to make the road cource woosies happy by dumping more money into it just so they can cause more scheduling problems next year because its set up better for them.

sorry for the off topic. but back on topic, I belive one idea that i've brought up a few times would definatly help, SIGNS. most people can read, or understand an arrow, "bikes--->" "grudge racing (line up front to back)--->" "run whoever--->" and clearly label each lane, and even put lane numbers on the signs. It was never clear if it was grudge racing front to back, side to side, or where they were at, and when staging people, they seemed to always bitch at reid about "oh well i want to run that guy" and he is a lane over and two cars back, or something, just tell them oh well, figure it out for next time, line the cars up and go. Just how i see it. If they dont get the run against who they want they should pay attention and deal with it.

[a1320honda]

There are much less hot loop guys so i can see how we all get to go at once (and get more runs) compared to the regular lanes. You guys gotta remember its a lot more pain in the ass for us to get belted in, keep the bottle heater up to temp, put on the helmet, blah blah blah. So if ANY of the hot loop gets pulled, they all should go. Especially since they usually drag the track before the hot loop runs so we can stick. I apologize for having any advantage running out of the hot loop in the amount of runs we get but i guess thats how it goes eh?

Another thing ebout the hot loop is drawing in more spectators. Fast stupid cars are more fun to watch and draw more people to the track to watch them. More spectators= more profit. You run em more and the excitement factor goes up for everyone.

Exactly! the point about the cars that are usualy in the hot loop are the cars that most of the spectators wanna see. And I, just like Marty feel bad, cause the guys that are in the hot loop do get more runs, but remember that the guys there, generaly are better prepped hence not as many oil downs, are running quicker times than 90% of the cars in the regular lanes which means we can move through more cars, and most of the guys in the hot loop are experienced so theres less time waiting for the new guy that doesnt quite understand the idea of Pre-staging, staging and the sportsman tree lights.

Im friends with Reid and stood down there with him for more than an hour before as he pulled cars. Your never gonna make everyone happy, but if i were Reid, id openly give anyone who thinks they can do a better job than he the opportunity to go on down there and give it a whirl. Im willing to bet $$ that 80% of the people bitching would hand him the radio back at the end of the night and tell him hes doin a good job. From Reids point of view, its not as simple as just pulling the cars. Hes the first one that gets to try and look for the guys with no #s, no cages, no helmets...etc. on top of the fact that when people go down and start whining their not getting any runs, he has to stop pulling cars to deal with that BS. And when people DONT WAIT BY THEIR CARS AND THE LANE DOESNT GET PULLED.....THATS NOT REIDS FAULT. I cant tell you how many times ive stood with Reid while hes had to deal with a car that just sits there while the lane needs to be pulled. Wanna bitch at someone, wait till the douche gets back to his car and tell him to park it and go watch, or stay with the car. I think the biggest thing to do that would help is when people pay to get in, they get a hand out of rules as far as the lanes go. Like telling them the lane assignments, have races lined up for certain lanes and other lanes are just for racing who ever. An explanation of the way the tree works, and the speed limits and return road policy, where tech is, where to get bracelets and so on. I think that would help tremendously. I didnt mind the staging lanes being on the hot loop last year, the reason that failed is cause they were doing tech from the same lanes and that cause a TON of confusion. Anyways....thats what i think.

[3258]

I can tell you how we do it, there is a pair of lanes for slicks cars, and a lane for street tire cars. When they call street tires, then, and only then do go to the lanes. When you tech in,you have a punch card with the numbers 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 and they punch the card when you are in line waiting. as the street tire cars start to wind down, they call slicks cars. There will be no getting back in line because the punch card will indicate you already ran the session, get back to the pits. Thats it, very simple, and we had 175 cars last week and each had the opportunity for 10-11 runs in 5 hrs of testing. There is no need to hang out in the staging lane, wait till your called... otherwise it is chaos in the lanes

[scooter]

but when people are with their cars and ones behind them magically get pulled before them somethings not right.

just do it like we used to!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! we have not been doing that lately.

[trbo355]

Thats a good idea to hand out some general guidelines to anybody who gets a tech slip at the gate. First time racers have NO IDEA where to get their competition number or where the tech booth even is. Its a secondary problem but still adds to the confusion out there.
Im not sure what the raceways website has posted but there should be a rules and guidelines section that spells out safety equipment required for a given ET, where things are located on the premises, admission fees, how the tree works, absolutely no compost in the back of your "race" truck, must be sporting ALL your lug nuts etc. Most people (young and old ) are computer savvy enough to do a little research on the hobby.

How many people want to race but are too scared or intimidated to bring their car out because they know NOTHING and dont want to look stupid? It would make the drivers meetings WAY shorter so we can get to racing before 8:00. And the newbs wont slow things down by trying to stage with the back tires. LOL

You want things to go smoother and make the races appeal to the masses? Do these things.

[mark6052]

Lets take a perfect world. from the time I get the nod to start the f/c, do a burnout, backup, stage, make the run, exit the track' I know for a fact the clock is running 2 minutes; I've checked. Give the track an extra minute to gaze in wonder an you have 2cars in three minutes. thats 40 cars in an hour. so street cars, hmm... there already running but have to wait to do a burnout till the track is clear. burnout 5sec, stage5-10sec , run (10-20sec), clear track10-15 sec. maybe 1 minute per pair? thats 120 cars an hour, PERFECT world. Did somebody say 2-300 cars? and you wonder why you only get afew runs? Yes you should get 3-5 passes a nite. as for those lane jumping to get extra runs, some tracks use a sticker on the window. RARELY will it blow off. Use a black marker on the sticker after first pass and they can see how many runs you got. Maybe it will improve total runs. I agree on afew lanes for grudge matches and some for just run only. one last thing. the track has pushed for the fast cars to come out on friday nite to test instead of saturday. Jim promises the track is prepped as good as it can be.

[trbo355]

For the record, i think we were all spoiled a bit by the old track at the speed we got to make runs at. Hell, we used to be doing the burnouts while cars were still staged in front of us. And the tree was counting down while you could see the last cars taillights at the end of the track!
Add an extra 1 minutes time for safety to each pair of cars (including sweeping the burnout area so you dont take a rock thru the windshield) that go down the track multiplied by how many runs a night? Jeez i dont know how many times the green light pops every night but saaay 100 runs?

Thats 100 minutes of racing lost a night to doing things the RIGHT way. See, we were dangerous and spoiled in the good ol' days and its one more thing that slows down the nights fun.

[trbo355]

Heh, Mark beat me to the punch because i type slow.

(edit) Hey Mark, 10 to 20 seconds for street cars? Some get there in the 9 second time zone too. I fixed my wheelie damage and drove it to the store to get cat food and beer after work today. Street car. :-)

[mark6052]

there's the problem, not enough 9sec street cars! When I was out there lately on friday nites it seemed to me they were pulling cars out as quick as possible. they were stacked 3 deep, starting line, burnout, and waiting behind that. yeah there is down time, Jim is intense about track conditions. seems many of the cars bitch when they spin the tires. (everybody knows the kmart lot has more hook) yeah right.

[scooter]

marty, your crazy man :) but thats COOL.

even if they needed a 2nd person going through and helping the newbs get situated id be down for that.

its just next year i think i might be doing more racing, as in more then one pass b4 i fuck something up lol:D

[trbo355]

marty, your crazy man :) but thats COOL.

even if they needed a 2nd person going through and helping the newbs get situated id be down for that.

its just next year i think i might be doing more racing, as in more then one pass b4 i fuck something up lol:D

You wanna hear crazy? Ever used a 2 post car hoist as a frame rack? I worked till 4 am with some ratchet straps and beer and put about 2 tons pressure on the frame rails to bend it all back. LOL

Saved me the 200 clams the real frame rack was gonna cost me.

[scooter]

Macgyver did not get cancelled, he moved to spokane under the assumed name, "Marty Stromberger" lol............

[3258]

Macgyver did not get cancelled, he moved to spokane under the assumed name, "Marty Stromberger" lol............

LOL..... I think he can even make 'life saving devices out of houshold materials' He does the stuff we all talk about doing :D

[SOMTA]

I think it was when Progas ran it there were lanes to race whoever and lanes that were grudge races. I remember getting in probably 3 passes that friday and it seemed to move a lot smoother. Some sort of lane assigning would be good imo. If the grudge lanes got missorted or something somehow and there was an oddball you just pull a single car from the lane with no sort of grudge racing other than the clock.

If lane assignments do happen there really needs to be a hand out or something that is given to people coming in after the initial meeting starts. It would even help to have someone out there giving instructions with a brief map of where tech in happens, turn out lanes etc. I remember my first time out I was lost in the sauce, saw everyone lined up and people just walking around and thought maybe it was just parking. Went around where it seemed cars were rolling through and got bitched at I wasn't waiting in line. Few weeks after that when staging I saw some guy pull in and just line up in the cars without teching in. I saw him just sitting there and asked if he was racing or watching, said he was racing, and told him he had to get teched in or he was going to be pissed after he waited to get told to have it happen.

[silverfdturbo6port]

When i was out last friday i noticed that there was a lane open to the right the one againsed the hill. there was a track truck sitting there in the way but my first pass i went around it with a guy in his blazer and we ran then i went around the big loupe and backed into that same lane and got matt behind me in the crx and almost instantly we ran after the track was cleaned up from a crash. sitting next to me while the track was being cleaned up was the same mustang cobra and a newer one behind it and they left. so me and matt ran and then went back to that lane that NOBODY was using all night and again we go to run again instantly and i mean there was no time waiting at all. I think they do a good job staging as i ran 4 times in about a hour and 20 mins. when people dont stick by there cars they loose there turn and another thing that might take some time from what i saw is the prepping to make it stickier but for those who run slicks thats not a bad idea because going down a track on ice skates in a expensive car risking a crash is not in my books of things to do lol. i think it was ran well when i ran thats my two cents.

[SOMTA]

Other thing is the people that don't pay attention to the lanes moving. When we were last out there was someone in a newer Ram that left their truck, lane started to move and the guy was no where to be seen. So people from the other lane moved over and people were changing lanes trying to get around the guy. The people that aren't paying attention to their vehicles and aware if their lane is moving need to be booted or some type of warning system than boot them.

[spaz_22]

I think reid did a great job this year. Almost every Friday night I went out I got around 6 or 7 passes. The only night I didn't was when reid wasn't there. The kid tried that pull every car from a lane bs and I got maybe 3 runs. I would see people lining up in different lanes after they ran in another to get another pass. And buy the time that lane got depleted the guy forgot whohe let out first and they would usually make another pass. Here's what I noticed while I was out there. Give a handout paper to first timers, easy to findout because they won't have a number, explaining the rules, staging, exits, grudge racing, ect. The biggest thing I notice was people not using all the lanes. Everyone seems to use the first two lanes. I would make a pass, come around and the lane I just used was empty so I would line up again, I enjoyed it greatly. I believe the system you're using right now is working great, its just getting people to follow the rules and use up all the lanes is the problem.

[NIevo]

Well I've got a suggestion that might have been brought up at some point but I didn't see it so here it goes. First off I haven't made it out there in a couple years so I know a lot of things have changed. I think for this to work the lighting in the staging area and the pits would have to be better.

First figure out a number of cars that each lane holds, lets just say 20 for this example. Have one person at the back of the staging area getting people into the lanes, start with the first one, fill it to 20 and go on to the next. People would be responsible for getting with there partner if they have a grudge match before pulling into the staging area or else they are lined up with whoever is behind or in front of them.

Then when there are the set amount of cars, 20 for example, cone off that lane and run them all before moving on to the next lane. Then, remove the barrier and refill the lane. That would keep people from running and getting right back in the same lane and going again, which I have seen happen. Also, it would be a good way for people in the other lanes to judge exactly how long they had till they ran.

If there are so many cars that all the lanes are filled then go back to lane one and start lining people up behind the cone. This would prevent some lines having 10 cars while another has 30 and keep people from watching to see what line is getting ready to go and pulling back into that one.